[SAC-HELP] units of EVDP in SAC

George Helffrich george.helffrich at bristol.ac.uk
Thu Jul 21 11:11:33 PDT 2011


Dear All -

	Suggest the command line option be named DEPTH <d> {KM | M} like the syntax for FUNCGEN IMPSTRING <m> <n> {SECONDS | POINTS}.

	Opinion seems pretty much split on changing the EVDP definition.

	VERBOSE seems a good option for regional phases as well as core phases (lots of branch name suffixes).

	But chatty commands are a nuisance when you're processing hundreds of seismograms in a macro loop.  Think again about *always* printing out the depth, or, if keen on that idea, add a TERSE option (as for RTREND).

On 20 Jul 2011, at 20:52, Arthur Snoke wrote:

> This exchange is exactly what I had hoped would happen.  Thank you all.
> 
> Attached is today's draft of the traveltime help file a a PDF.  You can see my current thoughts.  A couple of comments:
> 
> 1.  Like Philip in his taup_setsac, I am allowing for either km or m for evdp.  We differ in what the default is.  If the input file has evdp in m -- and one knows it -- one can either change evdp to km using ch or evaluate before going into sss or one can use the depth-m command-line option (see second example).
> 
> 2.  Note that we have a verbose option, which prints out phase times while still in sss. It also prints out the depth used.
> 
> 3.  As seen in the second example, if one has not turned on the verbose option, the depth used is still printed out.
> 
> 4.  If one does not change the evdp from meters to km, error messages will be produced that tells you the depth is too great.
> 
> Arthur
> 
> On Wed, 20 Jul 2011, Philip Crotwell wrote:
> 
>> This issue caused me quite a few headaches with TauP_SetSac.
>> Ultimately I decided the best course of action was to do what the sac
>> manual says, and so evdp is in meters. Of course a huge percentage of
>> seismologists put the value in km. My personal bias is that if the sac
>> spec says it is in meters, then any sac commands that use evdp should
>> do so in meters, perhaps with a warning if the value looks like it
>> might be kilometer, ie >1000. To change the meaning of a header at
>> this point in sac's life seems like asking for more trouble and
>> confusion.
>> 
>> The best answer to this is to have the units in the header. But, one
>> of the strengths of the sac file format is the simple header. One of
>> the weaknesses of the sac file format is the simple header and so I
>> doubt there is any place to put it.
>> 
>> Philip
>> 
>> On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 12:53 PM, Renate Hartog <jrhartog at uw.edu> wrote:
>>> We (Pacific Northwest) sometime have small local earthquakes for which our
>>> locator gives a depth < 1km. Explosions certainly can have depth < 1km. So,
>>> George's scheme could potentially go wrong for those. However, it might be a
>>> non-issue for him because the DMC doesn't keep track of small, local
>>> earthquakes, i.e. there won't be any event information in the SEED file.
>>> Larger ones probably always nucleate deeper than 1km.
>>> 
>>> The easiest (least change) solution is to leave EVDP in m and provide an
>>> option to traveltime like Januka suggested. If the EVDP is a float field, it
>>> could be in km, as you could specify a shallow depth as, e.g., 0.255 km.
>>> Another thought is that with the advent of relative location algorithms,
>>> depth differences on the 10-s of m scale might be resolvable for clustered
>>> earthquakes and for that reason leaving the units stay "m" might be worth
>>> it.
>>> 
>>> -Renate
>>> Pacific Northwest Seismic Network
>>> Seattle, WA
>>> 
>>> On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 6:41 AM, Januka Attanayake <jattanayake at yahoo.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Isn't EVDP for nuclear explosions is < 0.5 km ? I am not sure if there are
>>>> any records of them in the IRIS DMS though. I suspect this is the reason why
>>>> meters was used as the default unit to begin with?
>>>> 
>>>> _______________
>>>> Serenity isn't freedom from the storm, but peace within the storm
>>>> Januka Attanayake
>>>> Earthquake Seismology & Economics
>>>> The University of Connecticut
>>>> Beach Hall - U2045
>>>> 354, Mansfield Rd;
>>>> Storrs, CT 06269
>>>> Tel :  860 486 0475 (Office)
>>>>           860 486 3914 (Lab - P405)
>>>> Home page: http://sites.google.com/site/janukaattanayake/
>>>> Research group: http://www.phys.uconn.edu/research/geophysics/index.html
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> ________________________________
>>>> From: Arthur Snoke <snoke at vt.edu>
>>>> To: SAC-help Listserv <sac-help at iris.washington.edu>
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2011 7:05 AM
>>>> Subject: Re: [SAC-HELP] units of EVDP in SAC
>>>> 
>>>> Comments on the two responses I got so far:
>>>> 
>>>> 1) Because traveltime did not work in SAC/IRIS, in the Help file for
>>>> sss/traveltime
>>>> <http://www.iris.edu/software/sac/commands/sss.com/traveltime.html> we
>>>> recommend using taup_setsac.  As with RDSEED, the default is meters for
>>>> EVDP.
>>>> 
>>>> 2) I thought about some variant of George's macsac 1000 switch between
>>>> meters and kilometers, but not having worked with very shallow events (of
>>>> any kind) I was not sure where the threshold should be set. A 0 value is no
>>>> problem, but does one use focal depths of 0.5 km?  Patly because of my
>>>> testing with traveltime, I am planning to changed the EVDP for fg/seismo to
>>>> 15 km.
>>>> 
>>>> On Tue, 19 Jul 2011, Arthur Snoke wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> To my knowledge, since IRIS/SAC v100, EVDP (focal depth in the SAC
>>>>> header) has not been used in any SAC command.  Please let me know if there
>>>>> are commands I have overlooked.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Because of historical reasons, EVDP (focal depth) in SAC has the units
>>>>> according to the SAC manual.  RDSEED converts EVDP from kilometers (which it
>>>>> is in blockette 71 in SEED) to meters when writing SAC waveforms.
>>>>> 
>>>>> For v101.5, the units of EVDP will be of interest because we will (re)
>>>>> introduce a version of the TRAVELTIME command, in which for waveforms with a
>>>>> defined location and origin time one can calculate arrival times for
>>>>> body-wave phases using the iaspei-tau tables for either ak135 or iasp91
>>>>> velocity models.  For this command, the units of EVDP matter.
>>>>> 
>>>>> I personally would like to evolve towards having kilometers being the
>>>>> default unit for EVDP.  As a first step, kilometers would be the default
>>>>> choice for EVDP in TRAVELTIME.
>>>>> 
>>>>> The point of this note is a canvass of the community to find if there
>>>>> are any problems with using KM rather than M for EVDP.  Let me know if there
>>>>> are other programs that read SAC files and use EVDP assuming it is in
>>>>> meters.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Arthur
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> sac-help mailing list
>>>> sac-help at iris.washington.edu
>>>> http://www.iris.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/sac-help
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> sac-help mailing list
>>>> sac-help at iris.washington.edu
>>>> http://www.iris.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/sac-help
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> Renate Hartog
>>> Research Scientist
>>> Pacific Northwest Seismic Network
>>> Department of Earth and Space Sciences
>>> University of Washington
>>> Box 351310
>>> Seattle, WA 98195
>>> 
>>> Tel. +1-206-685-7079 (office)
>>> 
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> sac-help mailing list
>>> sac-help at iris.washington.edu
>>> http://www.iris.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/sac-help
>>> 
>>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> sac-help mailing list
>> sac-help at iris.washington.edu
>> http://www.iris.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/sac-help
> <traveltime_july20.pdf>_______________________________________________
> sac-help mailing list
> sac-help at iris.washington.edu
> http://www.iris.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/sac-help



          George Helffrich
          george.helffrich at bris.ac.uk





More information about the sac-help mailing list